Ordering nightmare with Viper Hockey [Archive] - Goalielife

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Irishry39

12-20-2008, 01:08 PM

Moderators if this needs to be moved to a different section please feel free to do so. I picked this one becaue I will be reviewing my experience with this companies customer service and what product I did recieve. And here we go...

In late March I placed an order with Viper Hockey International after reading several positive reviews on another message board. At first there was wonderful customer service with rapid answering of emails and all of my questions about product fit and performance based on lengthy descriptions of my size, desired modifications and play style. At the end of March my down payment was taken and the order had a build date set. I ordered a set of leg pads, gloves, upper body pad, pants and double cup. At the last second I changed my color scheme from white to gold which held things up but that's my fault and I take ownership of that cause for delay. My final payment was taken in early August four months after the down payment. The final payment with this company is done when the pads are finished being made and are ready to ship.

Between June and July I began emailing asking how the order was going and the repsonses were getting few and far between. When I did get them the reasons for the delay in my order were various including pants taking longer then expected and medical emergencies. In September I was told they finally shipped. First the gloves and upper body pad and that a second box with everything else would follow shortly.

I waited a couple of weeks and after not getting them yet I began eamiling asking for a tracking number. When I did get a response I was told there was no tracking number but the had been sent. A week or so later I emailed agian and this time was told that they were sent to the wrong address but as soon as they were gotten back they would be sent out again. I kept emailing for a tracking number for the second attempt at shipping. I finally got one after multiple emails. Let me stress one tracking number for the two boxes I was supposed to be getting. I got one box on October 25th with the upper body pad and gloves. None of the mods I asked for were done but the graphics I requested were done fairly well.
The blocker didn't have the pinky sewn to the finger armor or padding under the palm which I asked for. The catch glove didn't have a lace cover on it and the upper body pad didn't have an extra set of floaters either. The stitching left something to be desired as well. I wasn't very pleased but I wanted to make sure this wasn't just the wait time clouding my thoughts. I wait another week with out getting my legs, pants and cup and begin emailing again. I'm told that the box must have been lost in the mail so I ask for a refund on what I haven't gotten yet. The next day I get an email saying that he just finished a new set of pants and can crush the rest out. I respond with I'll take the pants but to not worry with the legs or cup and to just refund on those two items. This was on November 6th. I still have yet to get a check, refund onto my credit card or my pants which at this point I don't want. I've tried emailing to find out where that box is but haven't gotten a response. I don't want to slag anyone but this has been horrible and my biggest hockey regret ever. I know things happen and the postal service can screw up but I'm on the verge of contacting my credit card comapny and taking drastic action. It has been to this point on December 20th nearly 9 months that this has been going on. I just needed to vent. Thanks RY

hroark2112

12-20-2008, 02:27 PM

Wow. That's just ridiculous. Totally unacceptable to blow you off like that, and to "lose" gear in the mail like that is unprofessional. There are a number of shipping services that use tracking numbers, and not to use them is lunacy.

Things like this are why these boards are so useful. For people who may be deciding on gear orders, this makes it easy to eliminate certain gear makers.

Moving Target

12-22-2008, 10:40 AM

Go to your credit card company and complain to them.

If its anything like Europe, they should refund you and take legal action against the manufacturer for supplying faulty goods / or not supplying as the case may be

goaliemedic

12-23-2008, 08:47 AM

Trust me, I know what you are saying. I put a post on another goalie site, about my order nightmare. James took the time to respond to it, but yet still will not respond to any of the emails and phone calls that I have sent him.

Have a read:
http://www.goaliestore.com/board/equipment-reviews/81474-viper-hockey-shoulders.html

Irishry39

12-24-2008, 11:43 AM

I've been following it. You posted the around the same time I posted on this board so I was just going to respond to yours. I was going to PM you on that board today.Your get dog piled pretty hard and people are missing the point. If some one tels you they're going to do something the probably ought to do it. I don't believe your whining nor lying about your experience. I already have equipment on the way that was super customized that I ordered mid October from Scott. I'm with you dude. When my employee gets in today I'm going to follow Moving Targets advice and call my credit card company. RY

Scott Battram

12-24-2008, 12:14 PM

Actually, you ordered Nov 1 Ryan!

Dont want anyone thinking we are slacking off and taking 8 weeks to deliver.. I think it took about 6 for the gloves and pads and the upper left yesterday morning!

Irishry39

12-24-2008, 12:57 PM

LOL, I better get my times right on this thread! That's right because I ordered the week after I got the gloves and upper body pad. The stuff looks great on the website and now it's a race between yours and my check from Viper. At this rate your going to win the race.

goaliemedic

12-24-2008, 06:33 PM

Irishry39

12-26-2008, 05:20 PM

I own a small chain of stores so I know what it's like to be swamped with work and not getting enough time to get things done the way I would like. That being said, I can't take money for an item and then not deliver or get it to the guest that paid for it whenever I get around to it. If I tell someone they will get a call or an email when something arrives for them or is shipped to them I make time to do that. Wheter the amount of the purchase is $25 or $2000 that guest is the most important transaction to me at that moment. I don't know if that makes sense but you never know who is going to recomend, or condemn, you to some one else. Reputation is hard to build and harder to repair in my experience.

snakebitten

12-27-2008, 12:57 PM

goaliemedic

12-30-2008, 06:26 PM

So, did you call, any resolution? Still waiting here

Goalerguy

12-30-2008, 11:21 PM

that sucks not getting your gear....

goaliemedic

01-03-2009, 04:45 PM

Ohhhhh, man......you gotta pick up a phone and call me......now I have egg on my face.....This is my fault.....( not like that of that other guy who is complaining for no reason)

Irishy, I screwed up here..... I admit this one. Call me Monday, I will get this cleared up.....Again I applogize......and Yes, I did really botch this one for you, no excuses. So I am humble enough to admit that when it is my fault.

James
Viper Hockey

I am the other guy who is complaining for no reason, and I still don't have my stuff...... It was supposed to have been mailed back on Dec 17th or earlier (he cannot give a date) and it still is not here.....hmmmmmmm

Irishry39

01-03-2009, 07:09 PM

Sorry, I haven't posted an update yet. I run a chain of comic book stores and shipping this week was totally jacked up because of the holidays. I didn't get chance to call yet. Now I'm the guy behind schedule. James if your reading my bad, Monday I'll call.

Hoosier Daddy

01-03-2009, 09:45 PM

I am the other guy who is complaining for no reason, and I still don't have my stuff...... It was supposed to have been mailed back on Dec 17th or earlier (he cannot give a date) and it still is not here.....hmmmmmmm

I'm curious as to what happened to your **** thread.

Every small manufacturer has been raked over the coals, at one point or another, at **** and, hopefully, some of them were better for it.

Scott used to get slammed for quoting times and missing them by a mile.
Vortek, Lightspeed and, I'm sure I could think of more, took all kinds of hell over there.

That's one of the things that the community is for.

I don't know James and I don't know goaliemedic but I do know that a member said he placed an order and paid for a product and the manufacturer did not dispute those facts. I also know that the fact that the product has not been delivered is not in dispute.

Somebody wanting what they paid for is not unreasonable. Taking that person's money and saying that they are "complaining for no reason" is.

acmeguy

01-03-2009, 10:59 PM

Before I ask for any money, I send photos as proof that the work is done. I think it's a good idea.

goaliemedic

01-04-2009, 04:09 AM

Before I ask for any money, I send photos as proof that the work is done. I think it's a good idea.

Great idea- tracking info works good too. I have even gone so far as to scan the shipping reciept and email it. Lol, guess that might be why no one has ever put up a blog about me (as a seller) and trashed me for not sending their purchase

goaliemedic

01-04-2009, 11:10 PM

As for my other post, on the other site, well they took it down. I guess the post had gotten a little out of control, I mean the thoughts that his kids might go hungry was just too much for me to take......naww got get a job at 7/11 if you are that worried about your kids going hungry! I still don't have my stuff!

I'm curious as to what happened to your **** thread.

Every small manufacturer has been raked over the coals, at one point or another, at **** and, hopefully, some of them were better for it.

Scott used to get slammed for quoting times and missing them by a mile.
Vortek, Lightspeed and, I'm sure I could think of more, took all kinds of hell over there.

That's one of the things that the community is for.

I don't know James and I don't know goaliemedic but I do know that a member said he placed an order and paid for a product and the manufacturer did not dispute those facts. I also know that the fact that the product has not been delivered is not in dispute.

Somebody wanting what they paid for is not unreasonable. Taking that person's money and saying that they are "complaining for no reason" is.

Oil Machine

01-05-2009, 12:12 AM

Before I ask for any money, I send photos as proof that the work is done. I think it's a good idea.

as well as keep in contact with the person too... (buy a mask or get a paint job from ron... i can say first hand, the man does over and above anything else anyone else will do)

there is a right and wrong way to do things, the right way gets you a customer for life, the wrong way gets you a one time deal and BAD word of mouth....

acmeguy

01-05-2009, 03:21 AM

Thanks Oil, I really do appreciate that, the cheques in the mail ;)

Sprawl

01-05-2009, 12:11 PM

the problem with smalll business and customers is that you have totreat the customer as always right, even when they're not. its a tricky thing to do, because 1 angry customer no matter how small of a business deal they may have made, might be the one to ruin it and be vocal. A small business needs to treat every customer, no matterhow big, or how small like they are the golden goose.

I also believe that the vendor should have the ability to defend themselves properly and answer to allegations. its good to see Viper hockey coming here and answering questions and remember, Vendors here are to be treated with the same respect you give any other member. Flaming and namej calling will not be tolerated and i hope you two can use the board to rationally discuss any problems. Problems do arise, it's human nature, it's how we solve those problems that define who we are.

Hope everyone here can resolve their issues peacefully and Amicably

And I stand by the following statement.
90% of your troubles will be caused by 10% of your business

Irishry39

01-05-2009, 01:51 PM

I think James and I are well on are way to that, that is if my guests and employee's can give me 5 minutes to make a phone call. ;)

habby

01-05-2009, 03:26 PM

Hey Oil, what's going on with our deal?
You said you would e-mail the confirmation weeks ago but now you keep avoiding me?
Have you changed your mind or something?
At least answer my pm's.
This is FRUSTRATING!

habby

01-05-2009, 04:09 PM

Sorry, Ryan......just found your e-mail in my inbox.
My frustration level is subsiding faster than Curtis Joseph's save percentage.
Sorry bout dat!

DRE75

01-09-2009, 02:03 AM

I will say one thing about Viper, the gear I got from James was OUTSTANDING. Did the mods I asked for, the specs were all perfect. He told me it would take a bit more time than expected (2-3 weeks extra) and that was no big deal, especially when I opened up the box and saw that what I ordered was in it.

Now, with Vortek, that's another story. They took my money right away, I asked for mods and a 2 colour fang graphic, they said there was an upcharge, I paid that, and *22* weeks later, a box shows up with gear that wasn't what I had ordered in it. That was 7 weeks ago, and the customer service jerk errr... clerk at Vortek maintains I will not get a refund, I am making it all up, and that the pads WILL work for me if I let them break in. :rolleyes:

How about, the pads will work for me if they were done how I ordered?

btw, pads are up for sale in Classifieds, nice looking set, just not what I ordered! :(

goaliemedic

01-09-2009, 02:26 AM

Sorry to hear that. Supposidly my shoulder caps were mailed prior to Dec 18th, never was given tracking info, which I had requested prior to them being sent.......and I still do not have them.

I will say one thing about Viper, the gear I got from James was OUTSTANDING. Did the mods I asked for, the specs were all perfect. He told me it would take a bit more time than expected (2-3 weeks extra) and that was no big deal, especially when I opened up the box and saw that what I ordered was in it.

Now, with Vortek, that's another story. They took my money right away, I asked for mods and a 2 colour fang graphic, they said there was an upcharge, I paid that, and *22* weeks later, a box shows up with gear that wasn't what I had ordered in it. That was 7 weeks ago, and the customer service jerk errr... clerk at Vortek maintains I will not get a refund, I am making it all up, and that the pads WILL work for me if I let them break in. :rolleyes:

How about, the pads will work for me if they were done how I ordered?

btw, pads are up for sale in Classifieds, nice looking set, just not what I ordered! :(

goaliemedic

01-10-2009, 03:21 AM

OK, so my shoulder caps arrived today from Viper. Yes, James came through, and they look wonderful. As soon as I get off duty I will give them a better going over. So, contrary to what I thought....I did get them.

Now, they arrived post marked on the 22 of Dec. For those who have been keeping up with this sage, you will know that was the day that I put up a post on the goalie store's forum, and that the item had supposidly been mailed prior to Dec 18. Much as I felt that I had been lied to about the tracking info, I am finding this to be a little suspect.

Mr. Peterman

01-10-2009, 06:01 AM

I just don't understand this industry. Endless stories about ridiculously late deliveries, mods or graphics not done correctly (Or at all!), money not refunded, no call backs or emails returned. What is wrong with these manufacturers? Look, I don't know anything about running my own business but, if you take someone's money for a service or product you have to provide that service or product or return their money. You'd think at worst case scenario the manufacturer would return the money so you can move on with your life. Don't they realize the more they mess up, the more you're going to want to talk to them about it. It's like they blow you off to get you out of their hair yet, by doing that, they force you to take up more of their time. And one thing the majority of people can accept is the truth. For example, if you said you were going to mail something today January 10 and you got caught up with other things and mailed it on Wednesday the 14th, tell the customer that. That's better than lying by saying it's in the mail but there's no tracking number and avoiding the customer's phone calls and emails. It's like they're trying to go out of business. And it's no surprise that on the other board people cut into you. That place is full of miserable, cynical bags of d that only take pleasure in being right or arguing until they feel they are right. Yay, Internet Heroism!:rolleyes:

Irishry39

01-10-2009, 05:30 PM

Just an update for any that may care. I missed calling the first time because my stores were way too busy for me to be able to step away. I've tried calling a couple of times since then but they've been closed. They are scheduled to be back open on Monday so I will call then. I think James has just been on a holiday break so no worries. RY

Irishry39

01-20-2009, 03:33 PM

Ok, got an email from James on Monday after I tried calling a few times. He's supposed to be sending a Paypal payment to me for the refund. I'll update when that gets to me.

Irishry39

02-13-2009, 04:13 PM

Since my last post I have gotten back $300 of the $1100 that's to be refunded. I may have overstated how well things have been going. :mad:

DRE75

03-09-2009, 12:38 AM

Placed my order for a set of pads from Viper, got it in just before they went retail, and I'm stoked about it.

This should undo all the crap that happened with my VK7 order, and really this is what I should have done all along, seeing how my BOAs were so perfect.

Marko35

03-09-2009, 09:12 AM

Sorry to hear something as maddening as that.My son has a friend who ordered pads and gloves from Viper about a year or so ago and had problems with the order.First they said that the set would take 6 to eight weeks to be made and shipped.He started to inquire after 9 weeks as to when he could expect shipment.He was told that the order was "almost" finished and to expect them within 2 weeks.Two weeks go by and no set yet.He calls again and is told that they've been shipped.He finally recieved the set 3 weeks later.He loves the set but the moral of the story is that Viper seems to lie about production time and shipping times to more than one customer.I have personally checked the set out myself and it is a well constructed set of equipment that performs quite well. Viper shouldn't ruin the quality of there product by not being honest and upfront about production and shipping times.

hammbone

03-09-2009, 10:49 AM

Viper shouldn't ruin the quality of there product by not being honest and upfront about production and shipping times.

I think this is key to any manufacturer. If they are making pro-level stuff, it's bound to be good. People are happy with pads from Viper, Vortek, Battram and even Sever.

And with these small manufacturers, we as customers know that they don't have a huge production staff so weight time may be longer than something like vaughn or reebok. I think if any manufacturer told me upfront, your stuff will take 6 months I'd be able to weight the pros and cons of the price vs the weight and hoe much I need that particular pad/brand.

But when they say 8-10 weeks and then, only upon consumer inititiated contact, you get "2 more weeks", "any day now".. "two more weeks" it starts to wear really thin.

It wears even more thin on guys that make you pay up front.

I think a lot of customers would be quite satisfied with the truth or even a very conservative estimate so that they can be happy if the stuff arrives early.

Irishry39

03-09-2009, 04:48 PM

Another update, got another $300 back. Almost there. Like I said early in the thread it wasn't a quality of product issue so much as everything else. Being a small business owner I know how things can go.

PatrickBateman

08-21-2009, 03:47 PM

I haven't heard such a bad ordering nightmare from an actual gear manufacturer! WOW Sorry to hear that.

I have had a bad experience with a dealer though.
cough::thegoaliecrease::cough

- You'd figure for all the money flying around, and these goalies commiting to doing a lot of research on what they need, that these companies would make the process easier, faster, and less stressful. And with all the competition between manufacturers, why wouldn't they?

Things have changed so much since when I started playing ('92). If you wanted new gear, (in Las Vegas anyway) you had to track down a gear catalog mail order, or try not to lose your mind ordering in a pro shop from some kid who's being trained how to sharpen skates.

Al Gore and his internet have simplified things for sure, and made everything more accessible, but what ever happened to honest business?
It's easy to get lost in the email-phone tag game.
GET IT IN WRITING FIRST! Good old fashioned pen+paper.

The good companies are out there, you just have to do your homework.

Bottom line: Brown, Battram, Simmons, Vaughn (personal faves)

Scott Battram

08-21-2009, 05:08 PM

You need to read the saga Redneckcowboy has had with another manufacturer. It could very well be the worst ordering ordeal in recent history.

rednekcowboy

08-21-2009, 06:45 PM

LOL, u can say that again!!!

I thought about posting in here when I saw it pop up on Today's Posts, but there's enough info around between here and the "other" board already!!

I think I may be making some headway with the bank now in retrieving my funds, was actually going to pm/email you some questions Scott about the Nexus combo, but I want to hold off until I know how things are going to work out. I might not have to wait until the new year after all!! :D

Gwyren

08-22-2009, 01:59 AM

Redneckcowboy, that is good news to hear.

Irishry39

08-22-2009, 10:19 AM

Masked

08-22-2009, 12:52 PM

I didn't want to perform thread necromancy but since people began posting on it again I'll update. I did get my full refund from Viper several months ago. Cowboy if you go with the Nexus you will not be unhappy. My lazy ass needs to post my 100 game review soon and I love them so much. All the mods I asked for really help.

Many of you guys are toting the small manufacturer card...I disagree.

****-ups in this business are universal.

I've been a Brian's guy up until about 2 months ago when I became a Battram guy...The reason was simple...Brian's ****ed up my order so hardcore on something so simple...I was left with fixing it.

In their opinion it had been my mistake and good riddance is where it was left...My error? A zero-g with a giguere break that 4/5 Brian's Employees didn't think would work properly but, not a single individual voiced concern.

Got them, went to some tryouts...My 5 hole wouldn't close and flared 2-3 inches because a giggy break doesn't exactly work on the Zero-G.

Then I went Reebok...Yeah, first and last time. I asked for a 35+3 or a 36+2...They sent me 2 different pads of different lengths...a 37+1 and a 38...

Bauer I can say more about but, I'm going to keep the peace.

Scott has been the only one to hit me back with suggestions//comments//opinions and isn't afraid to do so...He's very open about any changes I want to make and is on the ball; constantly, with anything and everything regarding his gear.

It's not just small manufacturers and I'm glad you've both sought reconciliation but, you don't hear about what the average pro goes through with Reebok...There's a reason you have so many pro-returns out there...trust me

hollywood

08-22-2009, 08:39 PM

In their opinion it had been my mistake and good riddance is where it was left...My error? A zero-g with a giguere break that 4/5 Brian's Employees didn't think would work properly but, not a single individual voiced concern.

Thats what you wanted and thats what you got. Who are they to say anything. I've read your other post on the matter and it's you fault not Brian's.

jf-laflaire

08-23-2009, 11:42 AM

Thats what you wanted and thats what you got. Who are they to say anything. I've read your other post on the matter and it's you fault not Brian's.

Yeah, I thought it was framed that way too:) I cannot speak for you, but, IMO I would've just made a break in the outer roll myself, or taken it to a reputable repair person. I don't really see how the lack of a break up there would've been the issue though. I personally like the break above the knee, and just stick with it. I would've given them some more time though, but that's me. I tend to not go from one style of pad to another unless I am 100% sure I can make the transition. I learned from a mistake years ago!

I'm surprised going from your Theif's to ZG's you didn't just take the Theif outer roll... I also don't think you can rely on Brian's to know your specs, I mean, they deal with quite a few pros. Alot of them are in stock Brian's pads too, as I know Ben and Don quite well, and I'll take their word for things.

I just dealt with Brians recently and await my ZG's. I felt that they will do anything, but, you have to really respect the design process they have going on there. The pads really do well in the drop test, quite frankly the best pads I've seen to this point in this regard.

I was going to revamp the leg channel to be like my current pads, but stuck with stock [with minor strapping changes], because I felt that they were designed to sit a certain way on the leg and in the butterfly. I also figured that I could do my open leg channel mod afterwards when the pads get worn out if I really found it to be a problem.

I've also dealt with Scott in the past, and he's very straight up as to what he thinks will work or not. I find he's more conservative though compared to Brians. Scott will outright say, "I don't recommend it," whereas, Brians will give you a price and ask you "why are you making this mod?" Remember, Brian's will do exactly what you ask for... they don't know how you perform on the ice as they are a large company. Scotty doesn't either, but, has his views on modifications which he voices more strongly. Remember, Brian's has to deal with pros [no offence to Scotty's stuff, just a fact, which I think is better for him anyways as its more of a headache from what I hear] and they want a particular mod, whether it affects the design process or not... and Brian's does it, they experiment, find it doesn't work and go to stock:D From what I understand, you're a pro, so likely got the same treatment:rolleyes:

Masked

08-23-2009, 01:09 PM

I've also dealt with Scott in the past, and he's very straight up as to what he thinks will work or not. I find he's more conservative though compared to Brians. Scott will outright say, "I don't recommend it," whereas, Brians will give you a price and ask you "why are you making this mod?" Remember, Brian's will do exactly what you ask for... they don't know how you perform on the ice as they are a large company. Scotty doesn't either, but, has his views on modifications which he voices more strongly. Remember, Brian's has to deal with pros [no offence to Scotty's stuff, just a fact, which I think is better for him anyways as its more of a headache from what I hear] and they want a particular mod, whether it affects the design process or not... and Brian's does it, they experiment, find it doesn't work and go to stock:D From what I understand, you're a pro, so likely got the same treatment:rolleyes:
That was my issue with Brian's. I initially asked for feedback, regardding the Giggy mod because, I hadn't gotten the mod I wanted on my Thiefs because they didn't think it would work properly. I had asked for a Giggy break there, as well only they felt; I should leave them stock so they did.

When I left it with them, this time...I said the same thing...Do what you think is best...I'm used to Reo and Karen hitting me back with feedback but, this time there was none.

After recieving the pad and calling them to THEN hear their concearns wasn't how the process should've gone...I wish they would've done as they had with the thiefs and just kept it stock but, again; not what happened.

The break was so tight, it was causing a flare of the pads; themselves...even after 30-40 sessions.

Reo and Karen agreed that, this was the situation and...Asked if I wanted to send them in.

While I do accept the fault of not calling them repeatedly as, I guess I should've...Spending another 200-300$ to fix an outer roll when all someone had to do was say, we don't think this will work properly with this design...Was beyond warranted.

Pro or not...The communication there was beyond warranted.

So...TLDR: Ordered Thiefs with Giggy break; never happened. Ordered Zero-G with Giggy break...Happened; wrong design for the pad.